Fourteen days later


Just fair warning, this post is a bit on the ranty side.

Ok, it’s more than a bit.

I am pissed.

I choose to write it here instead of in the comments sections of other blogs, or worse yet in the blue text of party chat.

Hey, what good is a blog if I can’t vent from time to time?

Just be advised, nothing constructive will come from reading past this point.

 I am going on vacation until next Monday, I’ll see you folks then. Stay safe and have fun.

You can simply take this happy holidays wish, a wave, and a smile and feel free to mark as read.

Still here? /sigh. Well, I guess you must be a glutton for punishment, but I am gonna rant now.

All of two weeks ago today patch 3.3 dropped in all its shiny new LFG goodness.

In that time I have had good and bad things happen.

I had the terribad failpug that I wrote about last week. That one is still the worst, though I have left three others now once they made clear that they were elitist pricks.

I have watched folks struggling with the content, only to end up getting driven from the group by folks that are simply mean.

I honestly can’t think of another way to describe it.

The vast majority of the players I have run across are quietly competent. The simply buff up at the entrance, perhaps say hello, and then roll through doing their job.

Occasionally I have run across people who have no clue what they are doing. Generally the groups I have been in will notice that within a few pulls and offer the less experienced player some advice. Sometimes there is an asshat with that wants to make themselves feel good by running a new player down. Usually there is only one like that, if any, and I have found they are not really that vocal if they don’t have a second elitist tool with them.

Apparently they believe in the safety in numbers thing, even in a virtual world.

I would have loved to have names for the pricks that bailed on us after wiping to wave eight four times at the beginning of one instance (Halls of Reflection, I believe). It was annoying how they wailed and cried saying that it was in fact the fault of the healer and other two Dps. It could not have been them because they were both “hardcore”. It really pissed me off when I found out that you can drop group and be ported out while in combat.

Thats exactly what those asshats did. The pally tank that couldn’t grab all the adds and the mage who apparently did not know how to use a threat meter. Good riddance to them.

Nice job, wipe number five.

It would have been nice to make them be the fly on the wall as we calmly put ourselves back into the que, picked up two more folks (who incidentally were far less “uber-hardcore” than those we had lost) and proceeded to one shot the rest of the instance.

There was only one more death, and that was right at the very end the Rogue went down at the same time as the last ice wall.

When it was all said and done I watched as all four of my party members rolled achievement spam for both normal and heroic.

Other than me, none had ever been there before.

.

I have come to expect the occasional asshat while I am hitting up the random heroic. It’s just luck of the draw.

One thing that I am seeing that surprises me though is bloggers that come out as elitist asshats. I have been hearing whining about people purchasing gear with emblems since they started dropping in Karazhan. I am sick to death of it.

Seroiusly, go beat that dead horse elsewhere. I have no place for it in my feed reader.

Guess what you pompous jerks, people are going to get gear. It did not break the game then, and it won’t break the game now.

The only thing I can even fathom as a semi-legitimate whine is this somehow making it harder to tell peoples relative skill level by glancing at them in Dalaran.

Whatever…. I am seriously considering gathering a set of completely ridiculous gear to wear while I am in town. Diamond tipped cane, some low level crafted gear that is enchanted with strength, that kind of thing.

Oh, damn. I wonder if I can put a fiery enchant on my diamond tipped cane? That would look sweet.

.

Back to the matter at hand though (as my mind is now whirling with plans to build a set of gear to annoy the gear score folks with).

I am sick of listening to the whining of the self aggrandizing fools those who think they are better than others. People that think that only they and their little band of buddies are worthy of actually playing the game.

I am tired of hearing about how other people are getting carried through heroics by tier 9 raiders.

I am sick to death of whiny prima donnas thinking that their shit don’t stink because they have shinier purples, or a guild tag from a more “leet” guild.

Over all I am sick of the elitist attitude that puts down other players instead of helping them get better.

If acting that way is the only way you can feel good about your self then I don’t want to play at your level. It’s rather sad really if you have to use how much better you are at a video game to justify yourself as “better” than others. It’s even worse when you feel the need to put others down just so you can feel better about yourself.

.

Some play to beat the game, some just play for fun, and more than a few just to socialize.

Like Facebook but with much more to do.

I got news for you, you are no different from anyone else in the game.

You are not a special snowflake.

Those you group with are not all just extras in the movie about your life.

They are people, just like you.

Actually I take that back.

They are like you, only with manners.

.

I have news for you. I don’t look up in awe at your leetness, I pity you.

Now get out of my pug and go hang out with yout leet friends.

You can all be leet together, and strut about basking in each others leetness.

42 Responses

  1. Wow , Just wandered into you Blog by accident, :)
    That was some rant but i happen to agree with all of it.
    I was in a pug with some dickwad telling me my DPS was lame and how he used to shoot 3000dps on his hunter at level 70 :) and how i needed to get better geared before i tried these instances . ?? WTF it was H HOS :) i kept quiet :) and kept my 2nd spot after the mage and like to think i’m the better person, for not bitch slapping the pretensious prick.
    But apart from that my 3.3 experiance has been good.
    And would rather help someone then degrade them anyday…..
    Anyhow cheers
    Vorne Nagrand

  2. Sometimes it’s not the hardcore guys who are being mean.

    One of my friends was tanking this morning and the rest of the group bullied her into doing an achievement she didn’t want to do — when she said she didn’t want to, they called her names. It was the last boss, she didn’t want to have wasted all the time by just leaving there (I would have left mid combat myself), so we pulled it … and all four of them just stood and watched and called her names.

    Those guys were not elitists. If they were, they’d have done those achievements months ago (I am not an achievement person but if you are, you can usually find people in hardcore guilds to do them with). They just wanted to bully my friend for no reason because they saw that she had raid gear and was a good player.

    • In the same situation I would have simply left.

      I am not saying that all hardcore players are asshats, Far from it. Nor am I saying all asshats are hardcore players, far from that either.
      Hell, there was someone in the trade chat last night that wanted people to link achievments for heroic Nexxus before he would invite them to a group.

      I just speak from my experiences in the random heroics I have run.

  3. (I mean they pulled it, I wasn’t there myself.)

  4. Up until this past weekend, I’ve had excellent luck with the pugs I’ve had with my mage. There’s been a few sticks in the mud, but those got resolved fairly easily. Nothing terribly noteworthy.

    But then I was in H UP and we were going to try and get the achievement where the first boss has to kill one of the big, fat pustulent whatevers. (It’s early, can’t think of the proper name or achievement). Anyway. I got pulled up to the altar for phase two and NO ONE killed any of the banshees so I could be released. And I, of course, died. I mean, honestly… who the hell dies on that boss. I’ve never seen it happen. At all. Ever. Until this weekend.

    Now, I will admit that I lost my cool far too early and probably unnecessarily, but that kind of crap is totally unacceptable. So I just dropped myself from the group. But as I was DPS, I’m sure I got replaced quickly and they finished the run.

    Now, my druid tank. I don’t LFG with him too much, just guildies. Mostly because when I tank, I throw up marks for a kill order because that’s the best way for me to keep aggro. But with PUGs, I find I’m dealing with a lot of well-geared people. And they aren’t following the kill order, so I lose aggro. Or they AoE everything down, and I’m used to using Swipe to just keep aggro over the healer. So again, I lose aggro.

    Maybe I suck as a tank or maybe I’m just comfortable running with people who already know my style. So I rarely use my tank with LFG. Seems to be so much more BS dealing with that.

  5. I’ve had some mixed pugs, but none too terrible so far. I was in a DTK with my warrior and I was doing the most damage, but as long as the healer kept me up I didn’t care too much. The way I look at it, waiting the 15 minutes to requeue is worse then finishing the run in 25-30 minutes even with an undergeared group.

    @Darthregis

    You’re doing it right as your druid. You have two things you can do in those situations.

    1) Try your damnedest to hold aggro on everything – it really is great practice with people acting a fool. Vene at Tankingtips did a post about pugging a while ago.

    2) Let them die. As long as you and the healer are alive, you’ll probably finish the pull. All their high tier gear gets them is a steeper repair bill. If they drop group, all the better.

  6. Don’t enchant the cane!
    I put Icy on the one my bank alt carries, and it doesn’t show up at all. I think the little sparkle it has overrides any other enchant effect (though I haven’t / won’t test fiery for you :)). Yes, I wasted 50g or whatever on a visual effect for a bank alt that didn’t even work. Commence humiliation.
    :D

    (oh and I agree with your other sentiments too)

  7. I am a pretty damn special snowflake, thank you! :)

    I can’t really commiserate, because I have used the Random LFG thinger all of once. On my paladin, and I got Oculus. Which I don’t like on my hunter, and had never once tanked. Thankfully I had my Pocket Tree with me, and he helped me look a lot cooler and better as a tank than I would have on my own. We only wiped twice on the end boss, and that was the only problem we had. Everyone else in the group just.. did their jobs.

    I have to say that based on all the comments I’ve been reading on blogs recently, that I will probably shy away from using it on my hunter. I’m pretty confident of myself as a tank, I don’t think my delicate “don’t hate the devilsaur” hunter ego could take much abuse of the sort that is being dealt out!

  8. Hey,

    I have read your blog from time to time, but this is my first comment.

    I want to say, you’re now going to become my number 1 blog to read, because you actually said what I’ve been feeling for a long time – shut up about being able to get easy purples now. Finally, someone has said it, thank you!

    Also, with regard to the new PUG system, my boyfriend and I managed to group with 71 people before we got a tank and healer pair of asshats who refused to run us through H CoS because we didn’t have enough purples, and I didn’t have gems in my brand new gear (2 pieces, dropped in an hour!)…big whoop.

    We have run that instance worse geared than what we are now, and never had a problem. We didn’t in this instance either, and we ended up putting the two asshats on ignore so we never had to group with them again (although to their credit, they did stay with us through the instance).

    All in all, the new system is great and the majority of people don’t seem to mind running people through who aren’t well geared, so long as everyone puts in effort…luckily they outweigh the fail-players :)

  9. I love you, man.

  10. […] you check out Dechion’s latest blog post, you’ll find a rant that, really… /sigh. […]

  11. / clap clap clap

    here here!

  12. Yes! Thank you! I couldn’t agree more. I’m adding you to my blog-roll asap.

  13. AMEN!

  14. Great post.

    So far I’ve been lucky and only had 2 encounters with ppl above….

    one was a mage in H HoR who was the only one that had achievement at the time and was ordering everyone about and telling the hunter and priest about what rotations to use even though they were in t9/toc geared – by the end of the first wave wave of mobs, I was itching to test the vote to kick option – took all my will power just to resist using it

    second one was when i was healing a reg FoS run on the last boss – i was targetted by mirrored soul but everyone continued whaling on it which lead to my death….then i got yelled at for not stopping dps….

    when i tried to explain the mechanics of the mirrored soul that everyone’s dps is transferred to the target i got yelled at in caps no less – so for the 2nd attempt, i didn’t heal the mirrored soul target, it was a wipe, but it was way worth it as i said I told u so and dropped group

  15. This. *3

    There will come a day when someone gets votekicked from a pub for uber leetness, and it will be traced back to this post.

    Whythehell aren’t you on my reader?

  16. Welcome to my feed reader, thanks BBB for making me aware of this.

    I’ve been healing on my resto druid since 3.3 and I’ve met my fair share of elitist pricks. Almost never targeted at me, but more likely at some dps who doesn’t have 4.5k dps like the others.

    I’ve seen a lot of wipes in HoR because people can’t seem to grasp the idea of aggro… when the tank has a target, dps on that – how hard can it be?

  17. Holy cow….

    Apparently I struck a nerve or something.

    @Ben, thanks for the heads up on the enchant displaying properly. I totally would have wasted the mats otherwise.

    @Asara, Don’t stay away from the new LFG on my account. I can honestly say I have only had issues on a total of four runs. Four out of at least 25, likely more, since I got my [looking for multitudes] achievment last night. (perky pug is made of win)

    @Amortia, seems like your experience has been similar to mine then, though I have been running mostly as a healer. Way more good people than bad, but there was no need to rant about the good ones =)

    @BBB, thank you kind sir. I shall endevor to be (slightly) less grumpy.

    @Dazz, that mirrored soul thing is a really interesting mechanic. I have died to it more than a few times as a healer. At least I’ll remember to stop whacking the boss when I go as Dps…

    @Grimmtooth, when it happens I want screenshots!

    @Tureni, that has pretty much been my experience as well. That first fight in HoR is really all about aggro managment. As long as the group can work together to keep all the bad things on the tank it’s a wonderful thing.

    Best run in there yet had both a Rogue and a Hunter as part of the Dps. They alternated Misdirect/Volley and (I think) Tricks of the Trade/Fan of Knives on alternating waves.

    I never got touched sitting back in my little corner throwing heals.

    @ Everyone who has stopped in and read, commented, or emailed. Thanks for stopping by.

    • I just found your blog and I think I love you! I have a lvl 80 hunter and a lvl 80 DK. When my hunter first hit 80 my guildmates talked me into trying the LFG tool and explained how it worked and I was so excited. I sat there shaking and finally got my group. We got H FoS for my very first LFG. I didn’t have a clue what I was doing, but I was doing my best, I didn’t have great gear it was all blue but I was doing about 2200 dps and for a undergeared hunter with no clue I didn’t think that was so bad. I got talked to so ugly and told I had no business running dungeons and why didn’t I crawl back into the hole I crawled out of etc.. It took me months to get my nerve back up to do it again and now I rock them totally. I still only have a gs of 4870 and my dps is only about 4500 mainly because I refuse to go thru that same starter crap in ICC so i’ve never been and i’m not paying what they want in AH for that gear.

      All in all what I’ve learned is that while there are leet asshats out there most people are good people and if you tell them up front, “Hey, i’ve not done this one yet” most of them will give you pointers and make sure you don’t get in trouble. The leets? As soon as they open their mouths I take the debuff and leave who needs that grief?

      Now I’m in the same boat with my DK I just got her to 80 have low tanking gear and I can NOT make myself start tanking. My mind goes back to the hunter drama and I am like oh no way why even go there? Some day I will.

      Thats my rant.
      Sin

  18. When I sit in a group for a boss or two and then finally leave after I just can’t stand it anymore, I wonder if I’m being “elitist.” I explain directions and bosses and watch my CC get shattered and my heals get wasted and my pet have to tank mobs off the healer and then, apologetically, I leave. I look at some of their gear and wonder if they’ll think that’s the reason I left, was because they’re in blues. I’ve had arguments in the beginning of heroics where people have bitched about a tank in blues, and reminded them that’s how we did it when the game first came out. Yeah, sometimes I’m grumpy when running the same damn heroic over and over (I have literally gotten Oculus twice in a row, UP three times in a row, and OK four times in a row) but I never ridicule people and I hate that attitude.

    Every time I leave a group because it’s not worth my repair bills, every time I get irritated because this is the third wipe and the tank still can’t find the drake vendor, every time I watch a 1k DPS Mage shatter my CC and just let him die, every time a PUG wipes over and over on a raid boss that I’ve killed with one less tank before and single-healing and it just makes me so frustrated, I wonder if I’m not cultivating an elitist mentality. It actually worries me, every time I leave a group, write a blog post or simply show up to a group in my hardmode uber leet epics if people will take my frustration, my advice, my opinions, as being the product of thinking I’m “better than them.” It honestly bothers me and worries me. Sitting here, reading this, I wondered “Am I one of those bloggers? Is my attitude elitist? Do I come off that way?”

    Hell, I even wrote a whole article about elitism and the different forms, when it’s good and when it’s bad. I specified it’s not an excuse to be rude or mean. I apparently lost at least one reader over it, when all I was trying to do was differentiate between perceived elitism/necessary elitism and that which is plain ignorance, laziness or meanness. Yet I still worry about it. At what point am I allowed to be frustrated without people thinking I’m picking on them? I’ve had people flip out on me for being a jerk when I’m simply trying to offer advice (generally as politely and privately as possible) because they think I’m just being some know-it-all jerk, when really I just want to stop wiping.

    That got incredibly tangential really quickly, I think. This is a great rant with great points and it did make me think some more about what already is bothering me. I’m sorry you’ve had such terrible groups of people who are just asshats in the extreme. It has given me even more incentive to try to ensure I don’t come off this way to people, even when I have to leave a group from pure frustration and expensive repair bills.

    As a side note…Yeah, I think the gear resets suck, not because of everyone getting purples or whatever, but because of how worthless it’s made most content (if it’s not my main it’s probably never seen Malygos and in my hunter’s case, much of Naxx) and how I’m basically “forced” into revisiting the same content over and over (heroics) in order to maximize my gear. But I’ve stopped talking about it, because every time I bring up this point people think I’m talking about how I don’t want everyone to have as shiny of purples as me. It sucks to see that Druid who spams Nourish on Twins wearing the same rings or trinkets as me, but it’s not something I get pissed about. Gear no longer equals skill, and I’ve adjusted to that.

    Sorry, seems I’ve written a blog post in your comments…

  19. @ Bellwether

    For what it’s worth you have never come across as the type of person I was complaining about.

    To answer a post length comment I would need one of my own.

    Lets just suffice it to say that the type of elietism I am having an issue with is more about why something is being said as opposed to what.

    Granted someone can be an asshat while trying to be helpful. The ones I have great issue with are folks who use thier superior knowledge and/or gear to belittle others.

    If you are saying it to honestly try and be helpful = thats a good thing, it’s called teamwork.

    If you are saying it to throw blame on someone = honest or not, your going about it wrong.

    If you are saying it to make someone feel bad, or your self feel better = your an asshat.

    Bell, something tells me you are not an asshat.

  20. /applaud

    I’ve been lucky enough to not run into these kind of asshats so far, but I know they’re out there somewhere. Even the ones where I expected someone to flip out (the disc priest in normal UK whose heals consisted entirely of penance and binding heal for 3/4 of the instance – until he asked for help; the death knight who stood in the poison in AN because he’d never been there before…), people have kindly offered advice.

    Were I into forecasting the future, I’d bet these kinds of assholes will eventually filter themselves out of the system. After all, if they can’t get PUGs only with people of their expected level of skill, they’ll probably eventually quit PUGging.

    • I think what we will see long term is those that think they are above running with the masses will stop. Those that like to run will simply get better at running in groups.

      I know I have likely done more heroics in the last 2 weeks than I have since Wrath hit.

      I also know that without a doubt I am a better healer for it.

      Plus the little pug dog pet is cute as hell.

  21. Dechion:

    I hear you, boy oh boy, do I hear you. I’m not perfect. I know you arent. And I won’t tolerate any leetist jerks while I am healing the instance. Hell, even if I am DPSing the instance, I wont tolerate it. I think I might just have the record for Vote Kicks.

  22. I almost never run instances because I have insanely bad luck with pugs and am in a small, social guild that doesn’t have enough actives (or any actives at the moment) for runs. A friend talked me into taking my healer with his tank and running H Nexus. I’ve run that several times with friends and know I am capable of it.

    The dps we were with somehow pulled trash groups from huge distances and were generally jerks. On the mage boss the trash from outside her room randomly showed up – still not sure how they managed that.

    The most vocal of the jerks was a hunter WHO HAD A FISHING POLE EQUIPPED through the trash before mage boss. (My tank friend caught that and called the guy on it right after one of his particularly jerky comments.)

    On the trash in the corner after mage boss I DCed. Apparently they all went down shortly after other than my tank friend who held up for a long time while they yelled at him about what to do and then made fun of him when he died. Then they voted to kick me.

    Experiences like that upset me so much that it nearly ruins the game for me. It makes me sick that the game I love so much is populated with people who apparently can only enjoy the game by making other people miserable.

  23. Umm, that rogue that went down same time as the last wall wouldn’t happen to be Skinburn, would it? I recall a pug exactly like this about a week ago…

    • You know, I honestly don’t recall.

      I am pretty sure that the notes I took are packed inside a brightly colored box under the tree. They likely got used as padding (along with the newspaper that was at my desk)

      If I find them I’ll let you know =)

  24. Hey Jack, if your toon is feeling especially relaxed and you play alliance you can always run around in some nice comfy Kurkenstoks :)

  25. Guessing most of the “elitest” types are big asshats in real life (or the extreme opposite who have nothing to say).

    In terms of tanks and healz ditching out because the don’t like what run the random selector chose… I think they should have a 1-hour buff/debuff (whatever it would be) that prevents them from instances/raids. It should have an icon that says ‘Defector’

  26. […] the amount of blog posts that are going on out there, it seems that this wonderful tool has also made it evident that WoW is […]

  27. I have yet to brave the pug-o-matic without at least one guildie for the reasons you outline. Sounds like I had a very similar experience as you. Joined as dps/dps, got HoR. As we zoned in I saw all the skeletons littering the ground. Not a good sign. Falric and Malric were standing there waiting.

    We had a very well geared tank (class doesn’t matter) who was instantly complaining about how hard this place was to tank. We got to wave 4 or 5 I guess and wiped. Tank goes off on our priest (my guildie) about how far in the corner he was for the LoS pull. Called him a moron. Quit the group.

    We get a new tank but HoR glitched and wouldn’t start up again followed by a surprise return trip to Dal. Queue again, HoR with 2 of the same folks and yet another tank. Upfront the tank admits they had never been here and that his gear was just barely there. Everyone offered tips and at least 3 of us were familiar with the place. 1 shot no deaths.

    So hot shot with an attitude equals fail. Friendly folks with a common goal equals win and fun AND badges.

  28. Nice rant. :)

    It inspired me to rant a bit too, though probably in typifiying the kind of thing you’re going against.

    http://wowthinktank.blogspot.com/2009/12/druid-lfg-system-and-being-elitist-tank.html

  29. Amen brother!

  30. +1 helpful people in pugs make for a great run.

    I pugged into H HoR as a random on a bear tank. I’d only seen the first 3 waves previously in a failed run.

    I explained my newbness at this instance to the grp, and got a “no worries” from all of them. “Just keep agro on the melee, we’ll deal with the ranged”.

    The whole 10 waves consisted of DBM going off in my ears that I was losing agro, I was smashing keys & changing targets like a crazy man. I felt totally out of my depth and frustrated that I wasn’t able to get a threat lead. Then they complimented me on how well I’d done and how they usually pull much more agro. They explained the rest of the instance & we finished without a wipe.

    These were well-geared, well played toons from a cross-realm pug. There are good people out there, just have to /ignore the asshats as you come across them.

  31. I would say that I have to agree with you about that not being needed in the random dungeon finder. Generally if your geared well enough it doesn’t matter what the rest of the group does anyway.

    I am a pretty decently geared feral tank (mostly ToC and ToGC 25) and often I just ask if everyone is ready then buff and chain pull the instance giving out my innervate when it is off cooldown. My general feeling is that anyone who’s dps is lacking I can probably make up for. Generally I also feel that if someone is being a dickwad I’ll just defend the other guy and do a unanimous vote to kick.

    And to the guy above who is a feral tank that is getting pulled off of by dps, just keep doing your thing and let them keep doing theirs, they will learn after you let them die a couple times because in the current situation of the dungeon finder no one that is able to pull off of you if your doing decent is going to be dumb enough to kick you. An even if they do you have a five second query tops and they will take about 15 min to get a group so you can laugh at the fact that you are just asbfar as they are by the time they get another tank.

  32. […] some of what I have seen does not deserve it, but both myself and others have already talked about fail pugs and the asshats that form […]

  33. “You are not a special snowflake.”

    I absolutely love that line. Also, I’ve seen some leet asshats in the pug’s waving their clownshoes all around. Usually when they leave or are driven out the run is a metric shit ton smoother. It amuses me that they are typically replaced by someone not geared nearly as well.

  34. Pardon my language, but the ass-hattery has been running rampant since 3.3 came out. The WoW forums have actually gotten *worse*. Makes me wonder if the Devs take a look at the chaos this absolutely wonderful tool has caused and all the shitstorm that’s explodes in our faces and ponder destroying the game in spite.

  35. I Tank Raids, but I Heal in the LFG finder. On a few occasions I’ve Tanked while a buddy has Healed and we almost always get instant queue pops. For the most part, the groups have been quietly efficient. I wouldn’t say I’m totally geared out yet, but I am the #66 ranked Horde Feral Druid on my server currently (Mug’thol – Dreddnought) as well as the #208 ranked Horde Resto Druid, #211 out of 2038 total…but this doesn’t mean I won’t wipe. I have and will continue to wipe in instances and I will continue to laugh every time it happens. Why? It’s funny, that’s why, and it’s a game. First and foremost: A GAME!

  36. I agree it’s a game! A lot of people have forgotten that it’s supposed to be fun first and foremost and when they forget that they also forget there is a living breathing human with feelings behind that other toon. !!!!
    Sin of Blackwater Raiders..

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